December 2023 AI thread ...

Thanks for this! I'm mainly a offline player, have been for years in Raceroom. Really enjoyed the AI up to a couple months ago. Hope these fixes will point in the right direction.

 

Hi all - I might be a bit late to the party if changes are already being made but for what it’s worth, just want to note that I’d found similar to others here: too fast on fast corners, fast on straights but too slow on slow corners (seen across numerous tracks: Paul Ricard, Brands Hatch, Monza and at varying AI: adaptive, 100 and 105). But all balancing out to comparative lap times to myself.

That said, my personal thanks to all working on improving the AI. Regardless of the above, I’ve seen a vast improvement in AI quality so far and I’ve enjoyed my driving against them since the recent update. The AI level (when using a specific number) seems back to what it was before December update (as in speed relative to each AI level) and I’ve even found the adaptive AI to have improved and be more comparable to my speed. They even race quite cleanly too. So great work here KW!

 

Just tried the BMW235 at Brands Hatch, big improvement since yesterday's update!
Still some erratic weaving into T2 but that could be track related, overall though they were pretty good, step in right direction!

 

A.I. crashing at Brands Hatch around Sheene Curve and Dingle Dell using the Porsche Cup car.

 

What a massive difference in the AI, miles and miles better, thank you!
Gave them a run out this morning before I’m out for the day.
WTCR 2022 at 100% at Most default set up Hyundai.
Lap times are similar and they no longer pull away on the straights, they aren’t a torpedo in T21 and they aren’t slow from T5 to T10, absolutely incredible I have zero criticism to give, that’s made my weekend and thank you very much!
With TT Assen I’ll be honest I think this is just specific to the track and I remember this being an issue prior to the big physics update. They are still way too fast from T12 Mandeveen through to the final chicane. I do honestly believe it’s a track specific issue.
They are also a little too fast on the long straight after the first tight hairpin. Lap times are very similar in sector 1 but sector 2 and 3 they are killing me because of the respective long straights in each of those sectors. WTCR 2017 100% default set up Chevy. Everywhere else at Assen they are awesome, but those two long straights they open up a fictional DRS hack and fly away from me.

 

Ningbo full circuit no chicane WTCR 2019 default set up 100% in the Golf.
Should also mention in all my examples I always start 12th on a grid of 20.
The AI are having absolute nightmares on lap 1, along with both tight hairpins on the majority of laps. I’ve done three ten lap races and I’ve never seen so many white flag banners pop up in raceroom.
If the AI is in front of me going to a hairpin most of the time they are behaved, if they are behind me they get a massive speed boost to pass me and then they go off track and swerve all over the place when they rejoin. I watch them in my rear view mirror when I exit a hairpin and they are doing some whacky things. Needs to be seen to be believed if I’m being honest and it’s too long to type.
Lap times and sector times are comparable to mine, but they keep handing me the victory each race because they are whacky drivers with very unique lines haha.

 

Motorland Aragon Grand Prix layout. WTCR 2019 in the Golf 100%. Default set up.
I’m starting to notice the AI have serious issues with tight hairpins and are clueless on how to take them. They are throwing away leads at tight hairpins because they brake a bit too early and the vast majority of times they go off track, swerve back on and throw away lots of time and hand over victories to me.
They are again far too fast down the super long back straight. I can leave the left hander onto the long straight on their bumper and then slowly but surely I look at the delta and watch them slowly pull out about one third of a second before the heavy braking point and I watch the cars behind me get bigger and bigger in my mirror, but then they brake too early and make a complete mess of the hairpin.
From turn 9 the long curved straight again they fly away from me or easily get along side me from behind and then I easily out break them into T12.

 

I tried the TC Cup TCR cars at Aragon and Ningbo and I’m guessing they haven’t been touched because they had all the same issues as the WTCR cars with added speed boosts on just about every straight, more punty and a lot more crazy off track detour sessions.
Time to watch Indycar at Detroit!

 

TC Cup and WTCR are the same class.

 

GT4 100% Ningbo Full Circuit No Chicane is absolute carnage!
Lap 1 by the time I reach the first hairpin, I’ve gone from 12th to either 3rd, 4th or 5th. Not due to my apex skills, but my Mario Kart Esque avoiding carnage skills. I did five restarts and same results each time. On the 5th restart I decided this will be the race where I go to the end.
Hairpins again the AI really struggle, unlike WTCR the GT4’s stay on track, but they twitch n jerk n wiggle coming out of hairpins and throw away a lot of time.
Turns 6 and 7 they really struggle and they spin out so many times. I won the race not because of skill, but purely because I just waited for them to spin out at turns 6 and 7 which is a guarantee that they will. The splits between the top ten at the finish line was massive and gaps at the finish line were determined by how many times the AI lost it at turns 6 and 7.

 

GT4 at 100% Portimao Chicane layout.
They are so slow at every tight corner and at hairpins it’s like they are on purposely brake checking me.
I can cross the start finish line 1 second behind them and then be right on their bumper going in and out of the T1 chicane, due to how slow they are and how early they brake.
They definitely have issues with hairpins, they also have issues with tight right left or tight left right combos like at Ningbo and Portimao.
Everywhere else on track they are decent, but they brake so early in heavy braking zones, are slow getting through tight turns and lose traction exiting and are slow out too.

 

WTCR 2019 100% Portimao chicane layout. Default set up except I upped the wing to 0.00.
Pretty much the same as the GT4’s but these AI defy physics in sector 3. I’m the slowest car on track by 0.7 to 1.3 seconds in sector 3 because they have ridiculous amounts of aero, grip and speed especially through the last two corners going onto the start finish straight. They also love to go off track coming out of the final right hander to gain even more speed going down the start finish straight.
I’m off to play some non sim racing vr games now, but from the combos I’ve played my conclusion is
They have way too much speed on long straights, they suck at tight corners, they are awful with hairpins and they break way too early in heavy braking zones. Lap times are comparable at 100%, they lose all their time in hard braking zones and gain it all back on long straights.
That being said at Most with WTCR and GT4’s I have zero complaints, maybe they break a tad early into T1 but other than that they are great to race against at Most.

 

AI prone to accidents:
The car class (AI selection) ---> Porsche 964 Carrera Cup
The track layout ---> Nordschleife
The AI Strength setting ---> 95%

AI cars spinning in some areas of track.

 

Watkins Glen AIs since the recent big update are total turtles through sector 2! They drive a car like they have no aerodynamics whilest they are more on pace in both sectors 1&3

 

This is very noticeable on the GP-version with & without the chicane on the straight. Between corners Chute and Heel is where the AIs are so slow. I tried it with skill level 97 which is quite challenging on tracks like Spa, Road America, Brno and Most where I am often bullied by the P2 AI after I take the lead. At the Glen, the AIs might be as slow as 3+ seconds through sector 2 with GT3 and GTE cars, but even as much as 4-5 seconds slower than me with the Porsche 911 GT3 Cup Car Deutschland for example. On the shorter version they are somewhat less slower and bring a bit more challenges. Whilest the AIs are painfully slow, atleast on the brightest side the rubberbanding is now fixed, no more dilemma at the Outer Loop and no more lap one pile-ups on corner one!

 

I just did a DTM 2023 race at Zandvoort and the AI is too slow at Bocht 10 and Hans Ernst Bocht. They are slightly too fast at Scheivlak and the long last corner.

Another problem was that the AI cars were fighting each other all the time. This made the front runners so slow that the field didn't spread out at all during the race.

Spoiler: Track map

 

FR X17 @ Suzuka GP
Default setup
AI pace @ 100% seems too fast in sector 1.

In a practise session, I was doing about 4 seconds slower than the slowest AI. I initially assumed I just needed to find about 1 second on each sector, but then noticed I was actually doing purple times in sectors 2 and 3 and the 4 seconds was all being lost on sector 1. The best I could get it down to was 3.5 seconds but then in a race, they just pull away from me from T2 to T7 at a speed that seems impossible to match. Anyone else having this problem?

 

Great job on GT4 indeed. I've been testing this class and the AI is super-competitive and extraordinarily credible in its behaviour.

Now, not that I've seen the AI reach unsustainable speeds so far, but on this particular corner (10) at the Motorland Aragon GP, which is a very tricky one to do properly on a high-powered car, well they are able to negotiate it at full throttle all the time and carry so much speed that they always catch you on 11. Then they early brake at the hairpin (corner 16), a kind of exchange that helps keeping AI lap times under control, but that gives away their computational nature. Other than that it's great fun racing against them on this track. AI strenght was set at 103%



Also, Portimao pit entry is outside track boundaries, apparently, and the stewards issue an offtrack when going for pit service.