December 10th 2024 ai thread

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Andi Goodwin, Dec 10, 2024.

  1. ShortyBuzzGER

    ShortyBuzzGER Well-Known Member Beta tester

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    You can by looking into the aiadaptation.xml in user data
     
  2. MattStone

    MattStone Well-Known Member

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    Is there a chart to identify the codes for the cars and tracks?
     
  3. ShortyBuzzGER

    ShortyBuzzGER Well-Known Member Beta tester

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    Yeah, it's a bit of work unfortunately, but in the steam folder of the game ...\Steam\steamapps\common\raceroom racing experience\Game\GameData\General there is a file called r3e-data.json which contains all classes and tracks IDs (the file itself is sorted like: 1. cars, 2. liveries, 3. tracks, 4. layouts, 5. classes, 6. manufacturers, 7. teams). You can search for names in this luckily and you need to look up the layout id first and then the class id.
    And the aiadaptation is sorted by layout id and then all class ids, then next layout id and again all classes and so on.
     
  4. Alex Hodgkinson

    Alex Hodgkinson KW Studios Developer

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    I have seen your reports of a similar theme previously and taken the time to test myself as well as asking several of the testers to. However, the we have not drawn the same conclusion as yourself; the general consensus is that the Group 5 AI do behave in a way consistent with our other classes. We've found that our relative pace at the same % setting gets us similar grid positions and race results as GT3 and GT4 for example.

    It's true that the classic GT, Sports and Touring cars do require a very different approach to more modern machinery, especially concerning throttle and brake application. I'll encourage you to stick at it, keep chipping away and eventually the disparity will melt away.
     
  5. nedimmb

    nedimmb Member

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    AI difficulty: 95
    Full DTM 95 grid
    Track: Slovakiaring
    Starting position: P6

    AIs still too fast through corner 2.
    AIs are also too slow and cautious through sector 2(Mostly at turns 14 & 18)

    PS: I have raced with higher difficulties with TCR cars on this track and the T2 issue isnt as relevant with that class!
     

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  6. Nico Kunze

    Nico Kunze Well-Known Member

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    49 ai (11 dpi, 7 gte, 31 gt3) at daytona road course, myself in the dpi starting 10th, ai strength at 120, 60 minute race with a mandatory pitstop.
    That time of the year again so another report :D. Unfortunately the dpi ai are still a bit too slow overall on this track and struggle too much with the multiclass scenario to expect a competitive race.
    As far as pure pace goes the main issue of them being too slow on the oval sections could of course be avoided by running the default setup but on tracks like daytona, monza etc that just feels wrong to do :D (perhaps choosing if the ai runs high/medium/low downforce could be a feature request for some time in the future). Apart from that they seem to be pretty early on the brakes/get quite slow before the corner in turns 3 and 5 but then they make up a lot on corner exits in turns 3, 5 and 6 with turn 6 being a huge difference to what i can achieve and what seems humanly possible.
    Now onto the multiclass problems which i had hoped mightve been helped by the recent updates to the ai lines at daytona but cant really say ive noticed any major improvements. They lose the most time on the oval sections because they just struggle deciding where to go. I feel like it could be helpful to make the low line the standard line and have multiclass overtakes mainly happen on the high line (as is the general guideline in the 24h of daytona as well). Right now most gt3/gte cars are neither here nor there for the majority of the banked corners. Usually too low to safely go beneath them but also too high for 3 wide to even be a possibility and at times even 2 wide suddenly becoming a bit risky when they suddenly move up a bit. The other issue is that it often seems like the slower class cars seem to forget that theyre slower than the cars that just passed them and thus attempting things that dont really make sense for any party involved and occasionally lead to crashes that are almost impossible to avoid (had such crashes in turns 3 and 8/9 in this race). And finally they dont seem to "use their mirrors" and just blindly drive their normal line. Say im coming up to the trioval section before the start/finish line, a gt3 ai all the way to the right, me 30-40kph quicker and choosing the low line. A real person in the gt3 would simply stay high but the ai will drift lower and lower (as is their normal line) closing a line that i was already committed to and now have to either slam on the brakes, completely swing across the track (where there may well be another car) to take evasive action or just crash. Of course being a human knowing what the ai will do i can also just wait for the high line to open up but i shouldnt have to lift for a simple pass in the middle of a straight. Now i realise fixing all these issues might be a bit much to ask for but maybe at least making the low line the default in the banked corners could be possible and already help a bit. As things are i won this race by 30 seconds, had i not been completely punted by the ai 3 times it wouldve been over a minute (and i also played along the ai's game of "if theres a yellow flag, come to a near standstill and dont accelerate before the green flag even if the spot of the accident has already clearly been passed", thats another issue that unfortunately remains). Overall still a nice combo but serves more as an extended practice session rather than a real race at this point
     

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  7. Alex Hodgkinson

    Alex Hodgkinson KW Studios Developer

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    Sorry, where are turns 14 and 18 please?

    [​IMG]
     
  8. nedimmb

    nedimmb Member

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    S***e was looking at a wrong map. My bad. T8 and 10 were the corners. Sorry
     
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  9. Manfredk2

    Manfredk2 Active Member

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    ai 95%
    20 cars WTCR 2019
    track /layout Slovakiaring
    standing start
    start position 20

    AI brakes without reason before the second bridge (between T2 and T3). They also wiggle a bit left and right so i think there is maybe a kink in the racing line. 1st pic is the race leader, 2nd pic Honda, VW and Hyundai are braking

    Screenshot 2025-01-05 194325.png Screenshot 2025-01-05 194631.png Screenshot 2025-01-05 200805.png
     
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  10. Manfredk2

    Manfredk2 Active Member

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    ai 95%
    20 cars DTM 2013
    track /layout Suzuka GP
    standing start
    start position 20

    AI brakes without need before turn10 (the small turn before the hairpin). They brake relatively hard and then do a noticeable move to the right. Maybe there is a kink in the racing line. They do this as far as i see only in race (so maybe block line?) - in qualifying i dont see this braking/moving.
    laptimes:
    Screenshot 2025-01-25 113609.png
    red Audi is braking (i am the Bentley)
    Screenshot 2025-01-25 114225.png

    Screenshot 2025-01-25 114300.png
    Audi and Corvette braking
    Screenshot 2025-01-25 114515.png
     
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    Last edited: Jan 26, 2025
  11. Carsan

    Carsan Member

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    Something strange happened to me today. I have set a 37-lap DTM 95 race at Diepholz without a mandatory stop with adaptive AI. I started with soft tires and although almost on the rim it held me until the end, on the other hand the AI, some with hard and others with soft, have all entered the pits, so in the end I won the race. Is this good or are we talking about an error?
     
  12. Nico Kunze

    Nico Kunze Well-Known Member

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    Couple days ago i did a race with 33 (mostly) modern gt3s around bathurst. Ai strength at 106, 60 minute race, rolling start starting around 18th.
    I dont know how ai choose their strategy but it felt like almost all of them were driving on a low engine map which at least in the mercedes i was driving was not at all necessary (think i needed 113 litres and the fuel tank takes 120l max, driving on map 5 without any effort to save fuel). That meant i was overtaking them very easily on the two long straights (and it also shows in the sector times).
    As far as their driving goes they are very quick in the fast corners over the top of the mountain (so turns 6-10). A lot of them brake fairly heavily for turn 3 which should be just a decently sized lift. They dont always do that tho so its either drive normally and risk crashing into them if they do brake or anticipate them braking and risk losing a lot of time when they dont.
    And as a third point im aware the dtm24 included models are balanced best bop wise but it would be nice if some of the other cars also got some love. In this race i included the audi evo 1 (rather than evo 2) and especially in practice sessions those already stood out as very strong and the two bentley evos were completely op in this race, doing mid to low 2:01s when most of the current models were in the high 3s or even slower (although the bentley that won wasnt saving fuel, he drove away at the start and then stopped after maybe 40 minutes). I get balancing the z4 with a 296 isnt really happening, but that audi and that bentley were still normally racing in 2021 which isnt necessarily ages ago.
    With all that being said this was still one of the more enjoyable ai races ive done :)
     

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  13. Carsan

    Carsan Member

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    I have raced another 1995 DTM race in Hockenheim Short Classic at 38 laps. Now we have all started on hard tires and no one has made a pit stop unlike the previous one in Diepholz. I imagine that being Adaptive AI they have corrected their previous performance that was wrong, so now if I run a race in Diepholz again they will surely not enter, so it doesn't look like a "mistake". When I feel like it I'll try it again.
     
  14. ShortyBuzzGER

    ShortyBuzzGER Well-Known Member Beta tester

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    Adaptive just means they have adapted the level (80-120) to you, not the strategy.
     
  15. Carsan

    Carsan Member

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    I understand, but it is strange that since that race, now doing similar ones, they no longer stop.

    In any case, after several races I have returned to the fixed numerical system, the AI gives me more of a feeling of pressure and I feel it is more difficult. In Adaptive it's not bad but I see that the AI ends up being too slower than me and it doesn't give me that feeling of difficulty and having to be regular in my times.