I've just dipped my toe into R3E and it's mostly very good. But one thing continues to bug me. I'm of an age to remember when flight & driving sims combined a 3D environment with a 2D bitmapped cockpit. It always looked weird and as soon as PCs were powerful enough 2D cockpits went the way of the dodo. The lack of convincing head/cockpit movement in R3E gives the impression of a 2D cockpit. It looks weird. (I know there's the option to Inc/Dec Cockpit Cam Movement but it it looks unnatural, there's no movment in the roll axis and leaves you lurching back and forward when you change gears.) There's also the lack of high frequency vibrations either when you hit a curb or when you're barreling down a straight. Watch some of the Nordschleife videos on Youtube and you'll see dashboards rattling, bonnet/hood banging up and down, wipers vibrating as the speed picks up. In Assetto Corsa for instance the cockpit vibration is very subtle but very convincing (and to see how not to do it I refer back to the original rFactor). In R3E there's none of this. It all seems very static; very 2D. Any chance some life could be injected into the cockpit cam? update: I found this thread.... https://forum.sector3studios.com/index.php?threads/camera-tricks.4696/ ....which goes some way to help.
Here's an example of what R3E should implement. Watch the cockpit view from 0:23 Notice the parallax relationship between the top of the steering wheel, the bridge of the dashboard, and the bonnet. This subtle high frequency vibration in not only pitch, roll, yaw axes but crucially the vertical axis is what makes it come to life.
This might help: https://forum.sector3studios.com/index.php?threads/locking-camera-to-horizon.294/page-2#post-21314 Have a read of the whole thread though. You can use a text file search and replace program to edit this line of text for every car in the game if needed.
I say they shouldn't because mostly that's not sth you see through your eyes when you drive a car. That's sth you see when watching footage recorded with a camera that's been fixed to some structure inside the car. Our eyes aren't fixed to the car, and they aren't even fixed inside their sockets, they can compensate such things, at least to a certain degree. So the question is what do we want the game to simulate? The drivers (i.e. a human eyes) view, or a cameras view that's put in the drivers position?
perhaps only nice for replays, here I would like to see some high frequency vibration in the cam when driving on curps for instance. Just to add a bit more realism. While driving it would totally disturb me when the cockpit is bouncing in front of my eyes like in AC or iracing. I turned everything down. But it can be personal choice. I like watching my replays a lot ok, the on from below is not from me lol
In the video fl0wf1r3 posted you can see the bonnet vibrating, the webbing vibrating, the mirrors vibrating....everything inside (and outside) that car is vibrating and it's not just an artifact of the camera. This high frequency vibration goes a huge way towards simulating speed if done well. Watch from 7:50 - the whole car is shaking. It looks terrifying. In contrast R3E's default cockpit is virtually static and in my opinion looks dead (but others will prefer it). The current options only give the player either the static camera or a kind wallowing effect that tries to simulate g-forces on the head. Neither, in my opinion, do anything to simulate a racing car at speed.
Coming from Assetto Corsa I must say I love the sound so far in R3E. I mainly drive the DTM cars in Assetto but dislike their rather thin, buzzy sound. Then somebody linked me to a video of the Evo-II in R3E and I had to grab it. Sounds great. Basically I want Assetto Corsa's vibration in R3E, and R3E's sound in Assetto Corsa.
Guess I misunderstood your original post, so it's about surfaces/parts flexing? As you might have noticed the wipers in RR do start to shake a little while driving, but I have my doubts that RR with its current engine(s) would be capable of having sth like this applied to more components, at least not in a visually pleasing way. Maybe it's sth to consider for a time when the announced switch in engines has happened. Until then I assume they have more vital areas to work on.
in some models the wipers are shaking already (BMW Alpina, M6) really nice and it makes a huge difference in the sensation of speed. But also in the WTCC Cars right? not sure. I realizes this for the first time for the BMW Alpina
Mostly yes, but the effect can be simulated very well by introducing subtle high frequency movement to the player's virtual 'head' as seen in the clip I posted. There's no reason it can't be done, after all AC and R3E share the same underlying engine.
Hehe, go tell that to any coder. There is always a multitude of reasons why it can't be done. Are you sure about the engine thing tho? I have no idea what engines Kunos are using but I was under the impression they built theirs from scratch. Seriously tho, as said above I'm not fond of the idea of making the whole image "shake" or vibrate at a high frequency. Now for certain body parts flexing or vibrating I could imagine that being a neat addition, but again, there's certainly more pressing issues atm than that sort of eye-candy.
Not the same engine base, wayyyyy different. In R3E you can aways map a button to control head shake, I use that way and like it a lot. I'm aware of engine limitations, which makes easier for me to avoid delusional wishes.
Not the whole image - just the car/cockpit. Watch the clip I posted at 0:23 and see how the car behaves. It looks fantastic and gives a much better sensation of speed than R3E currently does. Compare that effect to the many onboard videos on Youtube, it's a pretty good approximation.
Going back to my original point of the whole car (the visual image of it, sorry for phrasing that a little weird in my last comment) shaking not really being realistic. Is that how it looks to you when you drive a car at speed in real life? Cause for me it isn't, most of that shaking is filtered out by the eyes or the brain when it processes the data it gets from the eyes. And I don't want to have the impression of looking through a camera when in a 1st person perspective, in any game. Never understood lense glare and such things in FPS games f.e. If it's supposed to be a human eye we're looking through, it should somewhat behave like a human eye and not like a static camera. As @fl0wf1r3 added, that kinda thing could be a nice touch for replays tho, cause there the camera perspective makes sense. Did you give the lock-to-horizon camera edit @James Cook mentioned a try? Cause I'm pretty happy with the way this works out on my end, looks/feels very life-like to me using these settings: https://forum.sector3studios.com/index.php?threads/locking-camera-to-horizon.294/page-3#post-58595
Agree on @Christian Göpfert and @James Cook here. What @Lixma is searching for is the "locking camera to horizon". Unfortunately there is no Option in the game for that setting so editing Cam-Files is needed...
Yes our eyes compensate for a lot of this but that doesn't mean we can't see these things happening. In the onboard videos the bonnet really is shaking, the mirrors really are vibrating, the interior really is rattling about and the driver really is getting bounced up and down. How this is translated onto a 2D screen is ultimately an artistic decision and I'm sure there are many tricks developers could use to recreate the sensation of driving an incredibly stiffly sprung racing car at lunatic speeds. High frequency vibration is one of the most effective ways in my opinion, and it's one that's missing from R3E. Yes, but it isn't the same thing. It's just a lazy camera effect which is somewhat pleasing on tracks with elevation but it does nothing for the sensation of speed. I'm not.
The text file edits I linked to have nothing to do with track elevation as it's not really lock-to-horizon. It's about feeling the bumpiness of the track surface and curbs as cockpit movement rather than movement of the outside environment that can be stressful on the eyes. You will get the same effect on any track regardless of elevation change.