Suggestion for new pricing model

Well if you 'buy content with Euro' you actually don't pay for the content directly with Euro. If you don't have vRP it seems like you have the option to pay in Euro via your Steam wallet, but if you pay attention to the process you'll see that you actually buy the right amount of vRP to then pay for the content. What happens is:

The car costs 299 vRP. Raceroom sees you have no vRP. You will get a screen to add Euro to your Steam wallet so that it automatically can buy the vRP needed for the content. Since you are essentially buying vRP first, and the content second, you get the same bulk discount as you would get in the normal vRP store. So after the discount the car would cost something like 2,98 or 2,97 Euro. In that case buying a pack of vRP will give you a bigger discount and would be cheaper in the long run. But if you buy a pack (or an experience or just more content at the same time) with a cost of let's say 2000 vRP via Steam you would save the same as when you would buy 2000 vRP in the vRP store.

So in conclusion:
- If you buy 1 car at a time via Steam you will receive almost no discount because the amount of vRP you buy is low.
- If you buy 10 cars at the same time via steam you will get a good discount because the amount of vRP you buy is high.
- If you buy 2000 vRP via the vRP store you will get a good discount because the amount of vRP you buy is high.
- If you buy any content directly with vRP you will get no discount on checkout because you already got the discount in the vRP store.

 

very clear, thank you

 

First, no need for name calling ("…click click click without brain…"). Also, I personally did not buy the packs during the sale, b/c despite my initial expectations that they would be on sale, so if that is aimed at me it isn't applicable.

Second, I do feel entitled to make comments and suggestions on this forum about pricing, content, and anything else that is relevant to the game, so long as I do so in a reasonable and respectful manner. I feel entitled to that because that is exactly what forums (and particularly "General Discussion" sections) are for! Unless there is an explicit policy against it, which I don't see anywhere, or unless the moderators indicate that such topics are off limits (and I can't see S3 having that reaction -- they have shown themselves to be very receptive to friendly critiques and suggestions).

Third, although the recent sale miscommunications are what most proximally prompted me to offer this suggestion, these are thoughts and concerns I've had for a while, and I think the sale kerfuffle just shined a light on some of the potential issues that many have had for some time. So, I thought this was a good time to discuss some of these things and, for the most part, I think it has been an interesting discussion.

Glad to hear that. That was my primary intent with this thread. Although I think there is potential benefit in the model I suggested, I certainly appreciate that others might disagree, but I think the broader discussion is interesting and worthwhile.

I'm not so surprised that many are not digging my suggestion, but I am surprised by how many comments more-or-less state that everything is just fine as is with the current system. My single biggest issue is that it seems to be a major factor keeping many potential users away. A big part of that is that it can very quickly get quite expensive compared to other sims aside from iRacing, and it can be unnecessarily convoluted to try to get a good deal and not pay more than you need to. Someone mentioned subscriptions feeling like a chore, but the current system often feels very much like a chore to me. You really have to do your homework to ensure you're not paying more than you need to. I'm all for consumer responsibility, but we're buying content in a racing sim as a hobby in our free-time, not buying a house, so it would be nice to have a simpler setup that doesn't leave the buyer wondering if (or worse yet, later discovering) they overspent.

Here's a few questions that I think illustrate some of these points. They should be simple to answer. But are they?

First, if a newcomer to the sim wanted to buy all content available as of today, what would it cost? I recognize no one needs all content, and many don't even particularly want all the content, but again it should be easy enough to find the answer. In most other sims, it can be answered quickly and easily. But it actually takes a fair amount of work for R3E, and I suspect that different people would arrive at different answers.

Second, as a slight variation of the first question, what is the LOWEST price a newcomer could pay for all current content? And, once you've found your answer, how confident are you that you are right?

Third, for those with some content already, how much have you spent? Even that question can take a good deal of effort to answer. In my case, I think the answer is $89.04 (I've been on board since late Nov '14), but it took more time than it should to work out, and I'm still not 100% sure that is exactly correct. I'd have to put even more time into it to be confident. For Assetto Corsa, Stock Car Extreme, rFactor2, and Project Cars, the exact answer is quick and easy for me to find. iRacing takes slightly more work to find the answer, but not nearly as much as R3E. BTW, that is more than I've spent for any of the other sims (admittedly, I've not gotten pulled very deep into iRacing so far). I have all circuits (excluding hillclimb), but less than half the cars and far less than half of the liveries. And that is with buying the bulk vRP from raceroomstore, waiting for sales, and generally trying to be patient and get a good deal. It took a fair amount of patience and effort to keep it to that price for the content that I have. I personally feel it is worth it, b/c I enjoy the game enough to justify it and my financial situation gives me the luxury of not having to worry too much about it (beyond the general principle of trying to spend my money wisely), but I think that would (and does) scare off many newcomers. I'm am sure that it is/was possible to purchase the content I have for less, but that would require even more work to accomplish.

Finally, if you already own some content but wanted to get all remaining content currently available, how much would that cost? What is the lowest you could pay? How much time and effort does it take to ensure you are buying for the lowest price?

Again, I know not everyone cares about owning all content, but these kind of questions should be easier to answer than they currently are, and people should be able to be confident in the answer, not left guessing if they overpaid. Moreover, I think many potential users are put off by the magnitude of the answers to these questions. The f2p stigma (whether or not that is the best label for the system currently in place) leads many to to expect the game will actually be very expensive despite the base/demo/starter content being free. And, relative to most other sims, I'd argue that they are correct. Although I personally find it worth the price relative to my broader finances and the enjoyment I get from the game, I really believe these concerns are a big part of what is keeping many potential users away.

 

yes, it has been, sorry about that

 

There is so much in your post that I agree with, Art. I think I count as one of the potential new members you're referring to and I am definitely having trouble figuring out how the RRRE store/vrp/pricing/purchasing really works. It is so utterly confusing. I just can't imagine anyone claiming otherwise. There are somewhat misleading discounts on packs, since if I understand correctly, these are really just bulk purchase discounts always in effect. Also, the store will show you a larger discount on a pack with already-owned content, but how that's calculated is pretty well hidden.

I know you're suggesting a subscription model, but also discussing the store and purchasing confusion. As a new member, it's that confusion (and not the overall costs) that is keeping me from buying more content. So far. I expect I'll pick some more up as time passes (assuming my minor "menu images missing" bug is fixed), but the store really just needs to be cleaned up.

Please forgive me, but I'm copying here my post from another thread, since it seems quite relevant to this discussion (https://forum.sector3studios.com/in...r-pack-pricing-in-sale.2140/page-2#post-20769):

"I'd just like to add that I was excited about this sale, but didn't buy anything in the end. I'm new to RRRE, but own all of the previous SimBin games and played them for years before taking a break from sim driving and finally getting back into it last year with iRacing.

As has been so eloquently stated by many others in a few threads in these forums as a result of this 50% off sale, the RRRE store and pricing model is a complete mess. I had bought the DTM Experience 2013 and DTM 92 Car Pack on Steam during their recent Summer sale and was thinking I'd expand my RRRE content with this sale. But then I tried to figure out the best way to get the content I wanted at the best price. That quest was pitifully harder than it ought to be!

I've learned that buying a car doesn't get you all the liveries, unless you get that car in a pack. I think. Maybe that last point isn't correct -- do you actually get ALL the liveries for all cars in a pack? The store descriptions don't seem to make that clear. I started checking each car's liveries against what I saw was included in the packs and then gave up in disgust.

Even though I own some cars and tracks (from my Steam purchases), the store doesn't show which of these I own within a pack. I know I can see the owned content if I check their individual store pages, but why is that hidden on the pack pages? I also found that if I tried to add a car or track to my cart when I already had a pack in there with the same piece, I was blocked. So that's good, but again -- Why is that so hard to see up front?

I could go on an on, but you all already know this, so I'll stop. My main point is this: I am a potential new customer (to buy much more content than the starter packs I got on Steam) and I really want to like this product (coming very happily from previous SimBin experience), but this store/pricing/vRP nonsense is a huge turn off. It should not be so hard to just figure out what I'm buying and whether I'm getting the best value.

And before some of you might discount what I'm saying as a guy who has only spent a relatively small amount on RRRE, I've spent over $600 on iRacing in the last 10 months because I get so much from that sim. (Ouch! It's hard to see that figure in print. ) Granted, that's for a couple years of the subscription and most of the content and will get much cheaper (per year) the longer I'm using it. I am willing (and glad) to spend my money on a good product, but for now, the RRRE pricing is stopping me.

Thanks!
Justin"

 

yes, at this point, in the store there should be a direct link to the store FAQ https://forum.sector3studios.com/in...ence-faq-and-game-features-w-i-p.72/#post-218
as concern others your problems with web store, I could help you in PM, but one question at a time please

 

Thanks for the offer of help, Oppolo, but my questions are more rhetorical at this point. I do actually think I've been able to answer (most of) them by searching all over the forums, finding that FAQ you linked, and seeing how the in-game purchase window actually breaks down the pack prices, showing deductions.

My main point still stands -- that buying content for RRRE is unnecessarily complicated -- and that is a turn-off for new members. I was excited to grab some extra content when that recent 50% off sale was announced. I added packs to my cart before the sale, saw they weren't further discounted during the sale, considered buying the discounted single pieces, and gave up trying to figure out if that was actually a good deal. It should simply not be so hard to make a purchase. Sector3 wants people to buy content (I have to assume), but they don't seem to be aiding that process (not with me anyway).

Thanks!

 

be carefull not to add, at the same time, packs containing the same items, first you buy one of them, so after you have more deduction buying the other one

 

Having a discount like iRacing has, based on how much content you already own would be a real winner. I have pretty much everything, and am far too impatient to wait for numerous things to be release to buy them all in one go, to benefit from R3E's discount - I dare calculate how much I have spent over the last year on this sim, but they could ease the pain with a discount like that