Released 11th July 2018 - RaceRoom has been updated

Discussion in 'News & Announcements' started by J-F Chardon, Jul 11, 2018.

  1. Kan

    Kan Member

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    GTR1 cars so impressive, I hope more cars coming to GTR1 class, like R-SV,MC-12, DBR9
    GT3 cars everywhere!
     
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  2. R3E Rookie Racing

    R3E Rookie Racing Member

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    though i like the new physics of the FRJ which i tested today i have a hard time braking into high speed corners, for example corner #1 in portimao. brakes tend to block very soon, car almost impossible to control when driven on the limit.

    i do have kind of shitty equipement (thrustmaster T150 pedals). that might be one of the reasons, besides my poor skills ;)

    any suggestions how to tweak the setup ingame to avoid blocking brakes on the FRJ?

    thanks for any suggestions
     
  3. Christian G

    Christian G Topological Agitator Beta tester

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    See this for the explanation why it's like that: https://forum.sector3studios.com/in...oom-has-been-updated.11025/page-4#post-154706

    You can reduce the brake force to 80%, that helps a bit. Apart from that, just try to be super gentle with the pedal. The car weighs near to nothing, so the brakes work very well even at very little force. Just gotta adapt to that peculiarity I guess..
     
  4. ndwthx1138

    ndwthx1138 Well-Known Member

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    I have HPP pedals (which have one of the best sim brakes around) and reduced the brakes to 90% and it’s just beyond difficult to perfect. The car itself now does not want to brake in a straight line - add altitude change and it’s a complete gamble getting around turn one with any real speed.

    The other issue I have with the new physics in this car is the clutch/transmission. No idea what it’s doing. It seems like gear engagement reduces engine inertia some of the times drastically and other times magic happens and it actually increases. Then add to this the rpm lights and the actual tach bars don’t match during those moments. I do use a fanatec stick and the clutch pedal. I’ve mucked with the bite point but I do not appear to be grinding or damaging.

    Driving this car fast is now is a feat. I raced formula dodge 17 plus years ago, so I’ll admit it’s been awhile. It’s a lively car and the brakes in a car that size/weight is very different than most.. the weight transfer in this game while moving +100mph is just crazy to me and coming onto brakes on a nearly flat track is simply ridiculous - I don’t mean locking up - as doing that in a formula dodge is dice roll, but the mere “on” linear brake at high velocity results in a unbalanced left to right transfer that leads to visits of green pastures and foul language.

    NathanW
     
  5. Christian G

    Christian G Topological Agitator Beta tester

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    Can't say I've noticed excessive dancing under brakes...and that's with my ungraceful gamepad. Wouldn't happen to have any video of what you're experiencing?

    Regarding clutch/transmission: Not really involved with that kinda stuff (gamepad warrior), but there were some changes made in the last patch and I think I've read talk about those introducing some weird behaviour, so I'm expecting some further refinements in that regard shortly.
     
    Last edited: Jul 14, 2018
  6. ndwthx1138

    ndwthx1138 Well-Known Member

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    Interesting, I could not be competitive without heel toe’ing and rev matching, I pretty much do that on every corner with that car.

    I’m running low 1:53’s high 1:52’s on Portimao GP. AI is at 112%. If I could have better balance under braking I could knock a second off that from just turn 1. If when I upshifted it was consistent I’m convinced I could shave 1/2 second or more.

    I’m running in VR and have never recorded video before but it’s pretty consistent over 125mph - get on the brakes hard - modulate but don’t lock up and +75% of the time my steering wheel will jerk to one side.

    NathanW
     
  7. jf.tournier

    jf.tournier New Member

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    Hello @Christian Göpfert,

    same problems here with the FRJ : when i'm braking, rear goes, or wants to go to front. Very very hard to be fast in this situation. For the clutch, i feel the same as Nathan : it slips when you shift up quickly. If you remove your feet completly from accelerator, it's OK. It didn't do that before the upgrade. My english is not very good and maybe i would be more precise in french. If you want, i can describe you my feelings in french in MP.

    The rest is pure fun. Motegi is a very good choice and it reminds me my very first gaming sensations, when i played Gran Turismo. I was 14 or 15 yo. ;)

    Thank you for all your work.
     
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  8. Karting06

    Karting06 Well-Known Member Beta tester

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    You need to lift off now (removing feet of throttle like you said). Because before you could stay competely on the throttle and change gear, which wasn't realistic.
     
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  9. nate

    nate Well-Known Member

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    I took a look at this combo you mentioned to see if I could offer any advice here. I saw you put up a leaderboard time, so I used that to gauge some feedback here.

    First off, you are already very fast, so I dont think simple driving technique advice is going to help you out much here, since you already have that down well. :p Im just going to reference the LB time I saw, but this too might be less than relevant if you are actually doing 1:52's against the AI.

    For T1 specifically, Im not sure you are going to be getting much more out of that corner. To my eyes, you are already on the limit here, or pushing past it which might be hindering your exit speed. You are braking a pretty solid 30m later than I am, which I find very impressive, since I cant pull that off while still making the corner and carrying good speed through there. I would pretty strongly doubt there is another full second to be gained there, but without a live delta to compare against my time, I cant tell if you are exiting the turn slowly or not. The rest of the lap is probably where you have the most time still left.

    I know on the LB, I had about 5 tenths still on my time if I did everything nearly perfect for my ability. I botched the final couple corners, but ended up with a similar time to yours. And since it seems you were quicker early on in the lap, this leads me to believe your time gain is elsewhere.

    I just used the default 90% pressure and 56% bias on the brakes. With that, I noticed lowering the dampers seemed to help quell the rear end breaking a bit loose on me under braking for T1 and a few other spots. Maybe play around with the dampers if you havent. I also increased the front springs a click, though Im not sure how much that affected anything.

    You seemed quite solid through T3-4, so I imagine the bigger time gain would be in sector 2 for you, as you seemed good in the final few turns.

    Edit: If you were using a saved setup from the previous version of the car, that might be the problem too as those are not transferable at all anymore since the physics were entirely overhauled.
     
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  10. Christian G

    Christian G Topological Agitator Beta tester

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    Do you remember if those cars you drove back then had any wings? Cause according to the info I found it looks like they did...
    [​IMG]
    I've never driven a car like that so far, so I can't comment on how they compare to the real thing. But I know @Alex Hodgkinson has and I trust him when he says that's how they behaved when he had his way with them.

    Can only mirror nate's observations, that lap time of yours is already pretty slick. One thing I know for sure is that cars like the Formula Ford have on-the-fly brake bias adjustment and I would assume the drivers make use of it, especially when you got a track with declining braking zones, so maybe moving the bias up front (in those sections) would help you get even more out of the car.

    But when I was looking into this back in testing I watched several vids about the Formula Ford (cause that's the closest to our "fantasy" car ;) ), and the gist of those boiled down to some quotes, like "forget everything you know from GT driving", "can't trail brake", "whole different technique required", "momentum, momentum, momentum"... and probably my favourite: "That car is putting a microscope on your driving".
    I just think we cannot apply our "standard" best driving model to this car. These cars are not about braking, don't try to get the most out of the brakes but rather carry as much speed ("momentum") through the turn as you can.

    So from my pov it's ok that this car is challenging to be quick in. It's the open-wheeler entry-level car for a reason, it should and will teach many things about ones driving techniques. Wouldn't it be a bit boring (and unrealistic) if it could be driven just like any GT or high downforce car?

    Some technical remarks:
    You mentioned you reduced the brake force to 90 %, but on my end 90 % is the default value. That made me think you might have had custom setups for this car already from the old version. If so, I'd suggest to remove those and start from scratch, cause the car has been given a proper shakedown and those old setups won't do you any good.
    And because the patchnotes didn't reveal much info about what was actually changed on these cars, I feel like I should do that now, cause we can't compare laptimes to before the update. The power got dropped a bit (~15 hp iirc) and the weight was reduced significantly (~40 kgs). In these cars that means a reduction of about 10 % in both departments. The most impactful changes were applied to the suspension tho, everything was made a lot softer, because according to Alex those cars don't actually drive like go karts, there's a lot more life in their suspension.

    Hope this helped a bit.
     
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    Last edited: Jul 14, 2018
  11. R3E Rookie Racing

    R3E Rookie Racing Member

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    @ndwthx1138

    according to what nate and christian already said, same impression here. your time on LB is pretty darn good and especially in turn 1 you seem to be pretty much on the limit. although my skills are my biggest problem and i´m out 3-4 seconds it seems that i gain on you a bit in sector 2.

    @Christian Göpfert
    thanx for advise. i reduced brake to 80% and it helped quite a lot. i also tweaked a bit with my FFB using the in game clipping tool and got a better handle of the car, which is just really fun to drive because i got the same impression that it is especially for rookie drivers a great way to learn.
     
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  12. ChatCureuil

    ChatCureuil Well-Known Member

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    Why Procar M1 leaderboards have been reseted? In the patch note I see only sound change ("BMW M1 Procar - Coast transmission volume adjusted in cockpit").
     
  13. Karting06

    Karting06 Well-Known Member Beta tester

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    Clutch I think
     
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  14. J-F Chardon

    J-F Chardon KW Studios Developer

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    Correct, all H-pattern cars leaderboards were cleared.
     
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  15. Alex Hodgkinson

    Alex Hodgkinson KW Studios Developer

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    Brilliant discussion going on about the FRJ. I'll join in when I get home tonight.
     
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  16. ChatCureuil

    ChatCureuil Well-Known Member

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    Ha ok, I understand.

    I love the FRJ new physics, this car is surely sliding to my top 3 favorite R3E cars. I have the feeling of driving a real big kart and that's intense and fun. And as often Nordschleife is the best place to drive it. :)

    But I have no H-pattern so I can't talk about the clutch update that some people seem to have issues with.
     
    Last edited: Jul 14, 2018
  17. sbtm

    sbtm Well-Known Member

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    just tested the FRJ ... i love it. I don't have problems with the clutch or the braking some people talk about. :confused:
     
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  18. ChatCureuil

    ChatCureuil Well-Known Member

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    Did you change break balance? I noticed the default setup makes front wheel lock and that's safe, but if you set more brake to the rear you'll lose the rear at every brake lock and that's not safe at all. :D
     
  19. Xon3

    Xon3 Well-Known Member

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    Wow. I was shit-talking about this update and then i tried the FRJ.... Amazing!!! Already loved the old one but this one is on a whole new level. Also, GT1 is amazing! I'm blown away. Really excited for the gt2 update :D.
    I'm still pissed that no new features were announced though. I'm giving "the list" a pass on this one.
    Keep up the great work.
     
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  20. richlevy2003

    richlevy2003 Well-Known Member

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    As has been often mentioned here, frj was one of my favorite before, now it's the favorite. The sounds are great, makes you really feel part of the car now. Laguna seca with the new frj, you don't need real humans, just race the ai. Too much fun.
    Awesome job s3, thanks for constantly pushing the bar higher
     
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