Hello mates, I have tested now for 2 days the GT3 and WTCC 2015 cars on the Nordschleife. This thread has to be seen as positive critique to improve things not to hammer anyone. So I hope the devs and the RRE fans are not offended by this! I will give you my personal impression and sincere opinion! Okay before I start I have my settings on get real and TC is on 0. I have mapped my buttons on the wheel to incease and decrease TC. So I drive with preset 1 which is TC 0. Okay after testing it in-depth I have to say the new physics are way too forgiving. I really push the car to the limit and can break very late before the corners. At present I have zero issues with oversteer or understeer. The only time my tail kissed me bye bye was that I got accidently on the curb. I usually don't want to make any comparison, but in this case we need to do it to see the differences. If I would drive like this in AC or Rfactor 2 I would kiss the crash barrier in less than 10 secs I am certainly not the most high authority when it comes to racing. Maby the GT3 and WTCC cars behave like this under real circumstances? I have no clue, never driven such a car in real life. I would like to hear your opinion on this. Looking forward to your comments! nice greetz Tonbei
Quite the contrary! Talking about GT3: my opinion is that the new physics are now more demanding and less forgiving, still allowing you to be as fast as you were before... When I really make some pressure I have now a couple of sliding and twisting, which it were hard to see before the patch. To prove this, you can now see even AI having a few problems in some very few corners.
I give you another example GT3 car in the end of the Nordschleife 6th gear speed 280 km/h I can break very late and shift super fast down. No consequences to the engine or I get into a drift. At present at least for me it is not very challenging. I think the physics before were more demanding. Hate to say it but it feels a bit Arcadey!
Lol AC like glue mate what are you smoking? Hehe but seriously in AC I have to recover the car very often. But I understand people's taste are different
To the devs I made an interesting find! Tested again some GT3 cars on the Nordschleife. Under American Nationals is the Ford Mustang GT3 the physics on this car are spot on! I would say it feels and plays very similar to Rfactor 2. I had to be very gentle with the gas pedal or my tires would start to spin on the lower gears. Also had some slight oversteers had to fight to keep the car steady. I have tested then the GT Masters 2013 and 2014 all cars same settings. What I instantly noticed way too much grip and I could kick the gas pedal fully without any spinning. I don't know are the physics for the Ford Mustang GT3 the old ones? I can honestly say it feels and plays much better far more challenging. No joke all cars in the GT Masters packs are more leaning towards Arcade. You can test it yourself. My setup T300 RS wheel rotation 900 degree and I have set the steering force intensity to 30% default is 50%. The steering of 50% feels way too heavy. All other force feedback settings are on default. When you test it with these settings you will instantly see and feel the difference between the Ford Mustang physics and the whole GT3 Master packs. I hope you guys will take your fantastic game more to the sim route again. Have a nice evening guys!
The problem in the modern GT3 cars is, they are built for customer sport programs. (The Real vehicles) Mercedes says always, that her car was so developed that it is easy to move it quickly. Even Audi or BMW have developed their GT3 cars in this direction. I have never drive a GT3 car on a Racetrack. But i think ... Modern Racecars drives like the cars from Raceroom GTR3 Class. The question is, what say a Real Driver, about the Handling ? These are my 2 cents to this ....
Sector3 devs have consulted real drivers in order to deliver a more realistic experience. They have done this with DTM, WTCC, ADAC GT Masters and Audi TT Cup cars. Drivers who are actually drive these cars in these championships have offered their feedback. I tend to trust their input. I think what we have here is someone in the 'difficulty = realism' camp i.e. a car is only to be considered realistic if it tears your head off with the slightest press of the accelerator and struggles for grip in every turn. A GT3 car has to be relatively easy to drive due to the PRO-AM market this class is aimed at.
Physics feel absolutely fine on my end. I think you tend to drive better just because the feedback is very good, makes you feel one with the car lets say. You're bound to set faster times and have less hairy moments as you're on top of what the car is doing. I too think we need to get over this difficult = realistic myth asap.
gt3 cars in real are easy to drive but hard to drive on the edge like every car. so if they are to easy to drive you are to slow
gt3 cars are easy to drive until the very edge... irl (thats the whole point if the class) if you find these easier than ac then ur doing something wrong on the ac end (I can almost drift the ac ones).
I think I tend to agree with you to a certain degree. I have to say I am a big fan of the new physics and got to test them while they were in production, but have really enjoyed the progress that was made with them, not only to the tire model, but also to the aero of the cars. There was a lot of work put in to make aero play more of a role than it did previously. People were able to run absurd wing settings and get away with it without much punishment, and this has been remedied to a degree. Now there are many corners on various tracks that require a slight lift to get the car turned in properly to successfully complete, whereas before there were a handful of corners that were flat out and seemingly too easy. However, the cars do feel fairly simple to drive. Although I use the default setups and default TC, since they were given these settings based on real world data... and Im not one of those sim elitists that needs to turn off every assist in search for as much artificial difficulty as possible I would say that while they are easier to maintain control of, they are really difficult to push hard in. To get fast laps you not only need to be consistent, but also properly time your throttle response coming out of corners. Of course proper pedal work is crucial no matter what physics version a car uses, but that seems to be the case even more so now. Combine that with being smooth on your steering inputs, and the cars feel like quite a treat to drive. Personally, I can definitely feel the physics advancements that have been made. Perhaps you are just expecting them to be more difficult than they actually are? With input from real world drivers, along with suspension data from KW, I have to imagine the actual driving feeling of these cars is fairly authentic Cheers
I am not having the same issue as you, gtr3 and gt3 classes are some great tire burning fun, if I exit a corner fast and hit the accelerator too soon or hard, my car is heading for the guardrail or I am spinning around... never drove a gtr3 or gt3 car but that makes sense to me. I thought the previous versions of the program were a tad to easy to drive. I can feel the tire grip now, before I could not, the ffb is giving more information now, before I was guessing to much as to what I thought was happening... Though, it's all virtual sim racing here, maybe this just clicks for me. I like the direction they are headed rr3, ac, rf2 and am all give me the feel of the tires of the vehicle I am driving are in contact with the road, I would not have said that about all rr3 cars before this patch... Again, ymmv Just one old carpenters opinion
Exactly that, the elitist always comes out and spew that none sense. If you actually watch these guy race irl, I always felt that they have way more grip that I seem to be getting in the virtual world.
Those cars are fairly easy rides. GT3 was designed by SRO as pro-am production based racing for privateers and the cars are mostly customer cars, built with the amateur/gentlemen drivers in mind that regularly spend the equivalent of a house or two on being allowed to drive them. Which btw also explains the technical limitations which have been replicated in RR, like fixed gear ratios, TC on by default etc. Here's an entry list of last years Blancpain series and you can see that there are more Pro-Am and Am-Am teams than Pro-Pro ones. So my high-five goes to @MeMotS and @mister dog for being spot on.
Hi guys thanks for all your nice feedback a very interesting read. One is mentioning maby I am doing something wrong not pushing the car to its limit. For clarification in the time trials on several tracks I ranked most of the time on the top in the leaderboards. So I think I am not the worst driver after all I know how to push a car to the limit I am kind of surprised that most of you guys cannot see the lack in physics in terms of oversteer, understeer and even more now the braking points. At present I would consider this game as Simcade. On a psychological level I fully understand you guys it feels good and very satisfying, the car is always steady easy to drive and you flying like Superman through the whole Nordschleife. I for one don't like it the way it is now, no real challenge, feels more like a console game to me. Let's shift the gear to the breaks the new breaking points. Like I mentioned before at the end of the Nordschleife a speed of over 280 km/h 30 metres before the last tight curve I hit the breaks 100% shift down in 1 sec and the car always keeps steady never had any drift. My dear friends do you really think this is realistic in any way? Not to mention the engine gets not tortured or even damaged shifting down at that speed.This is more like Driveclub pushing the car to the limit and I am able to break very easily on the last metres. I am sorry to say this guys if you are experienced drivers you should have noticed all of this stuff. After 2 days of driving I am already bored no oversteer no understeer nothing, very unnatural breaking points, feels like driving on rails. If S3S stays on that route I will certainly move on not my cup of tea