Have you guys tried the Formula RR Junior - Knutstorp combo with the latest physics iteration? It is insanely hard. It really shows how much more detailed RR physics have become in recent times.
It was already the toughest car to master by several fold. In a multiplayer races more than half quit or crash out in a good race. now it’s even harder. It now over steers like crazy and the tires are getting hot quickly - despite being rock hard. Having raced formula dodge some years ago here in the states - this feels like someone leaked oil on the track but weirdly only on throttle in low gears. I wonder if the diff model is doing something new.. I enjoy the jr series and find some of the best drivers in RR make their way into that ranked server from time to time, but this is gotten crazy hard from a car that should be easy to drive at 80%-90%. my silly opinion..
The recent changes to the car where made due to people saying the tyres where to cold and it would lockup all the time, maybe it gone a bit far the other way but I found it much easier during my testing.
This is not a challenge or some machismo crap - you and I should do a few laps. You can show me where you feel it’s easier and I’ll show you where the car now seems to apply a lot more torque in 2nd gear. I’d be interested to see faster times. I’m reasonably quick and I’ve only lost time with this new patch.
@ndwthx1138 are you still using a setup you were using previously? Some adjustment ranges changed as well as the optimal tyre pressure window, so be careful of that. It's recommended to bin setups when cars are updated in the game, unless specifically stated in patch notes or by myself that's not necessary. Development focused around three main things: Bringing the tyres bang up to date with the latest camber, wear and slip curve behaviours. The second is a focus on the rear suspension kinematics and making sure the rear tyres are used more effectively. In this instance, the rear roll centre was raised which improves turn in and rear 'grip response', as well as an increase in rear camber recovery, which gives the rear tyres greater lateral grip mid-turn. There was also a focus on the brake heating and cooling behaviour, which was re-done using a newly created tool which calculated these rates more effectively. The net result is the brakes are more predictable as they spend more of the lap closer to their optimum temperatures rather than switching on and off at times, sometimes front and rear doing that independently. The only two changes to the drivetrain are a lighter flywheel (it turns out I'd over estimated the weight used on a Formula... BlueOval) and a correction of an error in the differential behaviour which meant unloaded driven wheels would spin up too easily.
Well it’s a fixed setup - you guys are not allowing for tire pressure etc in your ranked servers. So I hope it’s not a old setup? I will say the tires seem more consistent - but crew chief complains about tire temps often now where as before it was always “cold tires”. What I noticed and surprised me is sliding the car has very little effect on temps. But you have my trust if your telling me it’s more consistent/accurate. it feels like mid turn the grip level from the rear almost turns “on” in a almost binary way - coupled with a diff that seems to be set very low allowing the new found grip on the inside to seriously rotate the car - this results in low speed tight turns having very difficult over steer that isn’t snapping but at the same time you can’t modulate out of it - I’ve personally never witnessed this behavior in a zero downforce car on track. And to be clear this isn’t me lifting off throttle suddenly as I’ve pushed too far - that I get (driver error). Have you tried the fixed setup now? In order to battle this behavior I leave the car in a gear too high (I always say high when I really mean low - but to be clear the next ascending shift). I’m guessing the new lighter fly wheel is why you don’t bog down terribly. I for one really appreciate your efforts, research, and constant desire to improve. I also don’t think for a second I know it all and appreciate you giving more details/thoughts on your process/updates. I genuinely like learning/understanding from the experts. I can tell this car in particular has had some very special attention given to it. NathanW
@ndwthx1138 this is a cool discussion, thank you. I decided to get a few laps in as a sanity-check and found a few things to rectify, but one in particular was important. There is/was (in the live game) a slight variation in rear toe as the wheels move up and down. Thus making the rear end slightly unpredictable at times, as one wheel would be toeing in as the other toed out during roll. I've rectified that, and that will be making it's way to the live game very soon. There was also a slight mismatch in rear damper speeds, which when ironed out has made the rear end more planted. It's a friendlier drive now - thanks for bringing it to my attention.
https://www.instagram.com/p/CAXamZLgMfR/?igshid=oj0imwxjx8bh Although looking at it a couple more times real life seems to be the most likely option
Wouldnt get my hopes up for that But just in case then we might also have a shot at ascari (if it was ascari)
I used to like this car in the old days, also DTM 92. They were slightly slippery, but easy to catch or at least drift a bit. Now I find them undriveable or I have to drive them so slowly I might as well go back to the slower cars, which I prefer these days anyway.
The DTM92 on the old physics were very unrealistic though, they had tyres that never lost grip regardless of slip angle which meant that you could throw them at a corner at stupid speed and they would hold. The updated physics bring their performance into line with reality, so you have to drive them as such. They aren't particularly powerful at around 300bhp, aren't particularly light, and have tyre technology from 30 years ago. Performance wise they are below a modern TCR car for example. You can still slide them around but you have to be realistic with your expectations.
I agree. The changes to TCR, GT3, Silhouettes and FRJ have been more subtle and the cars are stil driveable. DTM92 / Touring classics went too far in the other direction, in my opinion and all the RWD ones are also undriveable for me now, the Audi being more forgiving but it eats through its front tyres and has massive wheelspins for a 4wd 350 HP car, which is also unrealistic. I guess we are in the minority and nothing will change, but it is disappointing when you test then buy a car pack and after a few months the product gets changed and most of the conteny becomes practically useless.
Eating front tyres and wheelspin is not unrealistic for that amount of torque (and weight) from an old quattro DTM Audi...also it has about 460 hp and you can expect an even higher number in Nm torque...
In an attempt to slow the Audis down, they recieved another weight penalty in '92. The car became so heavy that it had several tyre failures, even before it was pulled by Audi after the ONS decied their crankshaft to be illegal. So, I guess eating tyres like crazy can be considered something like realistic for this car... Source (Sorry, only german)